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  • Fluids
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    Walking Dead: Season Five Speculation Link to this post

    Robert Kirkman (Regarding the question, What is Terminus?):

    "There are an enormous amount of hints here and there in the finale that you could freeze frame and study and dig into over the span of months between the end of season four and the beginning of season five that will in some cases give you some pretty good hints and other cases be deliberately misleading as we intend it."

    “There’s a very long and involved way that Terminus came about, and that memorial is a big part of it. It’s what these people have lived through and what’s happened to them and what’s built them into what they are, which will be revealed in Season 5. There are a lot of hints when you watch this episode closely of what’s to come in Season 5, so I would definitely urge everyone to watch this episode multiple times and try to pick out the things we’re teasing because there’s a lot to find.”

    Let's figure this out!

    (Well..maybe not...however it's fun to be a detective and hear everyone's best theories.)

    What is yours (about what will happen?)

    I found the more I walked through S4E16 the more things I was able to conclude and observe.

    I suggest a re-watch of just the Terminus scenes a few times and then mulling it over.

    Hungry? You can grab a plate of Terminus here:
    Walking Dead: Terminus eh?: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/157

    Loads of time to speculate. I will be checking this thread over the next 7 months and love to talk TWD.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~
    For Groups here's what we got:

    At Terminus:
    Rick, Carl, Michonne, Daryl, Maggie, Glenn, Sasha, Bob, Tara, Abraham, Eugene and Rosita.

    Possibly at Terminus or elsewhere:
    Carol, Tyreese, Judith, Beth (and maybe Morgan.)

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Best fighters (arguable):
    Rick, Michonne, Daryl, Morgan and Abraham

    Secondaries:
    Carl, Carol, Tyreese, Maggie, Glenn,
    Sasha, Tara, Bob, Beth and Rosita

    Need assistance:
    Eugene and Judith

    Why is noting this important?

    Those things I think will play heavily into what happens at Terminus.

    I think the best fighters have to do the heavy lifting in the next season at Terminus.

    ***********THE CLUES AND LOADS OF QUESTIONS******************

    • We still don't know what 'A' stands for although as Rick's group is being corralled at Terminus there is an 'A' written on walls and the train car they end up in. What's the significance?

    • Some folks are speculating that 'A' stands for Alexandria, VA, which is next to Washington DC where Eugene, Abraham and Rosita are heading.

    • Another clue pointing us to DC is Beth's silver DC spoon from the Season Four, 'Still' episode:

    Walking Dead: The Silver Spoon: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/162
    http://www.thetvcritic.org/reviews/dramas/the-walking-dead-2/season-4/still/

    • Abraham is very strong willed. Will there be a struggle to lead the group between Rick and Abraham? Two alpha males and Abraham has a very rigidly defined mission. Will Rick go with Abraham to DC?

    • Eugene has to offer something more compelling to Rick then 'it's classified'. Now a bunch of them were at the CDC: Glenn, Carol, Rick, Carl and Daryl so they have already spoken with a scientist and should know the difference.

    • To me...Eugene behaves nothing like Dr. Edwin Jenner, so part of me believes they won't take everything he says seriously.

    • We also don't know specifically what Dr. Jenner said to Rick. Rick did indicate he said they were all infected with the walker virus, however may be there was more.

    • If Rick speaks with Eugene maybe the remainder of what Jenner said will be revealed and either confirm what Eugene knows or refute it. Perhaps it will turn out that Eugene is lying about knowing what caused the outbreak?

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    • What is with the room full of candles, sayings (“Never Again,” “Never Trust” and “We First, Always” ) and names of folks (along with former possessions) in the center?

    • Are these people a cult?

    • Perhaps this is a memorial to people who were lost at Terminus after some large disastrous event and for those who have since passed such as Alex who died in the gun battle with Rick and company?

    • What was this traumatic event that the Termites wouldn't allow to ever happen again?

    • Are the possessions by the names offerings to the dead? Perhaps they are personal affects of those who have passed?

    • What are the names? Are they dead 'Termites'? I saw roughly 43 names listed. None look familiar individually; perhaps there's significance to the names of these people as a group from something? There's a few families and folks from Woodbury. I imagine the inner circle were probably the more important members of the group. The closest to the center may be a former leader (Zane Camden). Perhaps Gareth or Mary are related to these folks? I wonder what their last names are? I hope there are some flashbacks with these folks in them in Season 5.
    (I was able to label 42. If you can find more names, objects or decipher more, please let me know and I will update the list.)

    Here are the names I can decipher:

    Stacie #ckinmon (Last name obscured)
    Christopher Adams (Innermost Circle of names)
    Judy Adams
    Shuford Adams: 17 (Innermost Circle of names)
    Sara Addison: Wilshire, GA; Raggedy Ann Doll (child)
    Matt Ayers: Woodbury, GA
    Eric Baker: Kennesaw, GA (Innermost Circle of names)
    Barbara Baldwin (Innermost Circle of names)
    Jenn Batch: 38
    Ashley Bennett: Plastic Sand Shovels (child)
    Jessica Bent: Marietta, GA
    Justina Bruce
    Zane Camden: 40 (Innermost Circle of names)(Possibly a former leader?)
    Joan Campbell
    April Case
    Brian Case: Woodbury, GA
    Sean Cook: Rosswell, GA
    David Cornett
    H Duncan
    Michael Ellwood: Stone Mountain, GA; Guitar
    Stephen Herayi
    Billie Hollified: Canteen
    Scott Jackson: Macon, GA
    Guenn Johnson
    Joy Johnson: Atlanta,GA; Stuffed Animal (child)
    Amanda Knight
    John Lee: Unreadable (Innermost Circle of names)
    Kristen Miller: 42
    Jessica Ogden
    Brendan Poole
    Thomas Richards
    Christian Roberts: Black Hiking Boots (Innermost Circle of names)
    Unreadable Roper: Marietta, GA
    Brittany Rose: 27
    Ben Ross: Decatur, GA
    Unreadable Smith: Unreadable, GA; Hiking Boots
    John Smith: 13; Soccer Ball (child)
    Nick Smith: Grantville, GA
    Justin Unreadable
    Timothy Walters: 25
    Rober Wolford
    Unreadable: Forest Park, GA

    • Are there any names of folks we recognize amongst those that were being remembered? As an example,
    is there a Morales amongst the names? (We have not see Morales and his family since the first season.)

    • 'Never Trust' must refer to new arrivals at Terminus right?

    If so, it doesn't appear to be walker related. How could you trust a walker right?

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    • Speaking of Walkers. Where are they???

    • Did anyone see *one* walker at Terminus?

    • Are the walkers being penned up in some area at the far side of Terminus?

    If they are killing the walkers as they arrive, shouldn't there be remains of the walkers in a pile somewhere?

    • Perhaps that is what the body pile is...walkers...and maybe these folks aren't cannibals?
    (To me the remains looked rather *clean* to be a walkers.)

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    • Rick runs past an area with a blue tarp that has many remains of humans on it in pieces. Are these people cannibalizing the new Terminus arrivals?

    • Do they allow those who agree to be a cannibal to live and feast on those who are bad or don't want to be a cannibal?

    • That looked like a fairly large pile of human remains.
    I know this a large property, however wouldn't that pile of human flesh be attracting walkers like crazy?

    ***********WHAT WILL HAPPEN? ******************

    • Do you think the cache of guns is still buried where Rick left them?

    • Are prisoners fed powdered milk and Termites eat what's on the grill?

    • How do you think Rick's group will escape?

    • Will we lose any characters along the way?

    • Are Tyreese, Carol, Judith and Beth at Terminus either in pieces on the blue tarp or alive in a railway car like Rick's group?

    • My guess is Carol, Tyreese, Beth and Judith aren't there. Why? Because Carol, Tyreese or Beth would have been screaming at Rick, Carl or Daryl by name as they were running past the railway cars towards their trap. Then again, they could be at Terminus with other more comfortable accommodations.

    Personally I think Beth is with the person who owns the funeral parlor. She's probably dolling up walkers for burial and singing about ' buying beer to shotguns'.

    • Rick and company have to go back and get Beth right?

    • Will Tyreese, Carol and Judith somehow rescue Rick and company?

    In order for that to work though, there would have to be someway that Tyreese or Carol would also go the back way and then Rick and company might be able to spot them from the rail car and let them know they are in there to rescue them.

    • Do you think Morgan will contribute in anyway?
    Last we saw him in Rick's old hometown. Is it possible that Morgan has seen the Terminus signs too? Is it possible he's locked in a train car at Terminus? Perhaps Tyreese and Carol will bump into Morgan and help Rick (et al) escape?

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Other Dead Threads on the TV Critic:

    Walking Dead: All About Daryl: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/160
    Walking Dead: Bob Stookey http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/167
    Walking Dead: Character Development through Story Arcs: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/168
    Walking Dead: A Cup of Joe: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/169
    Walking Dead: Daryl's Dilemma: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/editpost/467
    Walking Dead: The Funeral Home: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/161
    Walking Dead: Greene Family Thread is Waning
    http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/176
    Walking Dead: Luke, Molly and the Black Shoe: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/159
    Walking Dead: On Frank Darabont: http://www.thetvcritic.org/blog/frank-darabont-and-the-walking-dead/
    Walking Dead: Psycho Lizzie: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/156
    Walking Dead: Rhetorical Questions you have posed to yourself you would like to share with everyone (comments?) http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/152
    Walking Dead: Robin Reads the Walking Dead: http://www.thetvcritic.org/blog/robin-reads-the-walking-dead/
    Walking Dead: Season Five Speculation
    http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/178
    Walking Dead: Season Four Final Episode 'A' Speculation:
    http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/editpost/505
    Walking Dead: Show Axioms: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/151
    Walking Dead: The Silver Spoon: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/162
    Walking Dead: Terminus eh?: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/157
    Walking Dead: The Walking Dead Vs. Breaking Bad: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/43
    Walking Dead: The Train Tunnel Scene (deconstructed): http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/172
    Walking Dead: Walking Dead Novels: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/170
    Walking Dead: Walking Dead Spinoff News: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/editpost/508
    Walking Dead: What is the Walking Dead to you? http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/150
    Walking Dead: Wimpy Walkers: http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/177
    Walking Dead: Writers of all the episodes with our ratings http://www.thetvcritic.org/forums/other-tv-shows/show/166
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

  • Tiarnan
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    Re: Walking Dead: Season Five Speculation Link to this post

    I could be wrong because I only saw the scene once but when Rick and co enter the room with the candles It looked like there were objects placed beside all the names written on the ground. Could the room be some sort of memorial?

  • Fluids
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    Re: Walking Dead: Season Five Speculation Link to this post

    Absolutely. It appears something happened to around 40 people. I would speculate that they ran into a rough bunch of arrivals and things got bad. There are children listed amongst the names I am concluding because of the items left (stuffed animals, soccer balls, etc..) It's unclear if it's a memorial solely for that event and also for members of their group who have all passed on. (Like the guy Rick was holding a gun to his head.)
    The objects next to the names could be former possessions of those named or offerings (if these people are being worshipped.)

  • Tiarnan
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    Re: Walking Dead: Season Five Speculation Link to this post

    Yes the secrets behind Terminus is what gets me most excited for the new season because we know that Ricks group will defeat them eventually. I would love for there to be an episode next season showing the history of the Terminus group in the zombie apocalypse, or at the very least a few flashbacks.
    It would be interesting to hear Robins thoughts on this idea as well because I know he's a big fan of "The other 48 Days" and it could potentially be as interesting as that if executed correctly

  • Fluids
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    Re: Walking Dead: Season Five Speculation Link to this post

    Brilliant idea Tiarnan! I would love to see an episode led by Gareth and Mary where there are flashbacks to the 'incident' or whatever that bad moment was. They could also fade in and out moments starting from the beginning of the apocalypse until the present. As if Gareth was confiding their story to someone (perhaps a new Termite) and we are walking through his recollection of his time at Terminus. It would certainly give more depth to the weight of the struggle that will no doubt occur between them and Rick's group.

  • Tiarnan
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    Re: Walking Dead: Season Five Speculation Link to this post

    They probably will do something along those lines because the Terminus storyline will most likely last until at least the mid season finale and 8 episodes of Ricks group in a container wouldn't be very exciting haha.
    What's your thoughts on the fact that for the first time in two seasons there won't be a big time skip? It's not confirmed but obviously it would be madness if they did

  • Fluids
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    Re: Walking Dead: Season Five Speculation Link to this post

    Agreed that glossing over the period now is kind of foolish. It would spoil the suspense.

    Does 'no time skip' also cover that they couldn't use flashbacks? If so, that's challenging...

    I guessing everything would have to be in real time right?

    Possibilities:

    Overall, there could be mixes between Railway car conversations (scheming to get out and asking all those questions about where is Beth? etc...); interspersed with scenes at Terminus with the Termites there; interspersed with catching up with Tyreese,Carol and Judith.

    #1: The way they could get the Terminus scenes is to take out a character from the Train car as an intended victim to show Rick and company who's boss or to exact revenge for the death of Alex (although they shot him not Rick.) This would create suspense (not to mention anxiety from other members of Rick's group) and show them being lead through different parts of Terminus. This could be just to mess with Rick and company's minds or because they truly have some bad plans for that person. The person who as been taken can learn more about 'the event' that occurred at Terminus to cause the Termites to create the memorial and through conversations with Mary or Gareth (perhaps in the candle room itself.)

    #2: Rick's group can try to get someone out their car by creating a convincing mock fight (like Jon Snow with Qhorin Halfhand in GOT) and having the 'problem person' be removed from the train and held somewhere else (so that person can spy on the Termites so they can figure a way out of there.)

    #3: Another possibility would be that Tyreese and Carol get into Terminus the back way and Rick's group spots them and calls to them and they both sneak in and free Rick and company. What would concern me about Tyreese and Carol is if they run into Maggie's signs (if they have not been washed away by the Termites.) If they see Maggie's signs they might go in through the front door of Terminus and get captured.

    #4: One of Rick's group could already be there as a Termite? Perhaps Beth, Morgan, Tyreese or Carol agreed to the Termite credo and they are already on premise chowing down on portions of Terminus arrivals and maybe they can be converted back to helping Rick and their group escape?

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Tyreese and Carol and Judith I think definitely will be at Terminus if they are not there already.

    Perhaps the powdered Milk is being used to feed Judith?

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~
    If they used flashbacks:

    #1. Personally I loved the flashbacks with Hershel. It made me think that this was part of Rick's psyche (the moral humanity driven part) keeping him in check or balancing his savagery. If Rick indeed has become more brutal something must balance this within himself or within the show. Otherwise the show will lose it's humanity and perhaps viewership.

    #2. It's a better way to show the history of Terminus. More expensive way, however better story wise and character development wise.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Once they get out will they just escape? Or will they burn down Terminus, kill all the Termites and free all the captors?

    If the Hershel part of Rick still exists he will want humanity not to have to deal with this group that runs Terminus anymore, but preserve its apparent intention: Sanctuary...

    It would take a lot of ripping down of signs all over Georgia to keep people from arriving there, so the best way to handle that situation is by defeating the group at Terminus and installing the captors as the new group. They would then help Terminus arrivals instead of harm them.

    Rick's group could then either stay or go with Abraham, Eugene, Rosita and Tara to DC. If they leave than I suppose they could look at Terminus as a possible safe haven if DC turns out to be disastrous.

    Rick probably would leave with Abraham if there wasn't anything left of Terminus after they defeat the Termites. However, finding Beth first would be a priority (if she ends up not being at Terminus.)

    That might entail living and traveling in a much bigger group because there will no doubt be captors that will survive the Rick versus Terminus battle that will want to follow Rick.

  • Tiarnan
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    Re: Walking Dead: Season Five Speculation Link to this post

    I want them to use flashbacks. By time skip I mean that they won't skip a few months like they have for the past 2 seasons. Even if the season ended with the group heading to Washington I wouldn't of liked this because its interesting to see how Rick interacts with Abraham etc.

    between 2 and 3 we missed out on how the group became very tight on the road and also how the weaker members like Carol, Maggie and to a certain extent Carl became great fighters like we saw in 301.

    The gap between 3 and 4 wasn't as bad but it did hurt the flu storyline because we lost most of the Woodbury members and any emotions shown from the cast weren't shared by the audience because we didn't know who they were. And as I mentioned in my comment for "The Grove" it was hard to feel anything for Tyreese because we barely got any scenes from him and Karen.

    This isn't really a criticism of the show because I understand why they did it, all I'm saying is I'm glad that season 5 will surely pick up were it left off so the audience don't feel like they're missing anything.

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